Howard Miller(Hermle) MSU02 116 cm ????

[disciple_dan]

I have really jumped on one now.
I have a 2003 Howard Miller. It's a Hermle but doesn't have the Hermle numbers stamped on it. It has MSU02. Is that a H M number. I'll try a search on the H M site to see if it comes up. It looks like a 1171.
Anyway, this one has all the bells and whistles. It has a night shut off feature different from the last one I worked on. Much more sophisticated. I'm studying it closely and taking lots of pics.
One thing I need help with on disassembly is the cable spools. They are held in with a push on clip that is made to go on one way. It has a tang on each side of the square winding arbor. It slides on easily but when you try to slide it off the tangs bite into the arbor. I''m sure you have all seen them.
I'm not sure how to get them off in a way that I will be able to use them again. Or do I need to order some of them?
Heres a couple pics of the movement for your eval.
Thanks for any help. Danny

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[disciple_dan]

I just did a search and found that this movement could be a Kieninger. (And most likely is.) Doesn't Howard Miller own Kieninger? Please correct me. Thanks
Yes, and I wanted to add. There are no E clips on the back of the arbors for these spools.

[jim1228]

Hello Danny,
The MSU02 is a Kieninger movement and yes Howard Miller does own Kieninger of Germany. The retainer clips you are referring to can be pried off however, they are brittle and the little tabs will break off, better to just replace them. It would be best to just pry them up a bit and cut them off. You can purchase more from Timesavers part # 20904 for 30 cents apiece.
Have an awesome day,
Jim

[disciple_dan]

Jim, thanks so much for the info. You even had the part #. Thanks, I have some on the way now. Have a great week. Danny

[disciple_dan]

Hello, I'm still working on this Howard Miler with the Kieninger movement.
First I want to say what an unfriendly way to retain the cable spools. It was no fun task prying those retainers off. I would have really struggled without Jim's help. Thanks again, Jim.
I have a slight problem now. I had all the other parts removed and in their respective bins and I was removing the last spool ( the chime spool I believe.) I got it out and picked up the front plate and the spacer shown in the pic fell on the bench. Thank God it hadn't fallen off earlier as I had been turning and studying this thing for two days with all of the exterior parts removed. It could have fallen off and been lost.
So, I had never noticed it on the front and have no idea what it was supporting. Maybe it will become obvious when I'm reassembling it but if anyone might know off hand where it goes I would really appreciate the info.
I'll try to pay closer attention next time.
Thanks a bunch, Danny

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[willofiam]

I think that goes under the auto correction hook or the long lever (chime side levers) they are next to each other on the right side. One way to check is to put the levers in place with the plates together and see how much play there is on the shafts of the levers or while on a post, if the washer fits the lever arbor or post and puts it to the right spot...there you go...go thru you photos and maybe you will see it??? Those things that fall off and you didnt see ....ha...I think someone is trying to mess with us with thin washers, small ball bearing , tiny springs and other inventive ways to put things together. Have fun!!!

[disciple_dan]

Thanks, Wiliam, Yeah, I looked back at my pics. I had taken quite a few of the night shut off but didn't see the washer so I'll look at the levers when I get it ready to put back together. I'm glad it's only one washer. What if it had been a whole hand full? Ha!!!!!!
I pulled up your website today and watched some of your vid's. I have been in construction most of my life too. Still am in fact. Longing for the day when I can do clocks full time.
Well, Thanks again Wiliam. I let you all know how it turns out.
God bless and have a great week, Danny

[disciple_dan]

Ok, I have all the gears back between the plates. I must say, I did it without peeking (at my pics) I narrate the process and it helps me understand what each gears function is.
So, I watched William Porters videos and now I feel so inadequate. Even still, I am doing the best job possible with what I have. I don't take the easiest way out. I'm so thankful for people like William. He is always willing to take time to help a brother out.
So, I watched William's video on the hammer tail assembly. I had never taken the assembly apart before so I wanted to learn the best way. The one I'm working on is just starting to show some wear. I'm not set up right to do the kind of job William did with the lathe so I was wondering if I could just do it very carefully with a hand file. I think as long as I take the same amount of strokes and keep it all square with the world It will be fine.
Any thoughts?
Also, What do the numbers mean on the pin barrel?
Thanks again for all the help. I couldn't do it without you guys.
Be blessed, Danny

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[willofiam]

Dan, thank you for the positive input and kind comment...that is what inspires.... not sure if I would do much on the hammer tails with those......if they dont have deep grooves the hammer tails should be o.k and that style generally doesnt, the ones with actual pins on the barrel alot of times do have grooves in the hammer tails and require dressing or new hammer assemblies. ...as long as the hammers get picked up enough to strike without binding ...maybe just touch them up????. but only if it is necessary.....If you go too far removing material you can create other issues...always keep in mind when deciding to remove material that it is very difficult to add material back on...I have never paid any attention to those #'s on the chime barrel, I just set up like any other style....

[disciple_dan]

Great info Willaim, I have the movement trains and levers completely assembled and ready to test. Now I will assemble the hammers and put them on and put her on the test stand.
Thanks for all the good help. Danny

[disciple_dan]

Hello all, disciple_dan here. What a beautiful day it is to be alive. Hope you are having a great one.
I Got this MSU02 back to the customer and it was working fine for 2 weeks. That's 2 windings. Well, she text Sunday morning and said it had stopped running after she wound it. I assumed some sort of cable/spool problem and that is exactly what it was.
The problem is it didn't seem to be bound up, on the spool. I couldn't see any overlapped cable. I was able to release the click spring and pull the cable all the way to the bottom. It was very hard to pull it down. I put the weight back on and carefully wound it up. It was working fine when I left it.
I am praying it was just a fluke and when she winds it up on Sat. morning it will be fine.
Has anyone had problems with those spools? I was trying to be ready for the worst should it still be a problem.
Thank you and be blessed by the best today.
Danny